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Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Sat, 14th Feb '09 9:14 PM


I am so surprised I knew nothing about this (or had forgotten if I ever learned/read about it.)

Which says:

It was in April 1933 and in his first ''official'' act in office; President Roosevelt declared a banking ''holiday'' and issued the order to confiscate gold. Executive order: By virtue of the authority vested in me by Section 5(B) of The Act of Oct. 6, 1917, as amended by section 2 of the Act of March 9, 1933, in which Congress declared that a serious emergency exists, I as President, do declare that the national emergency still exists; That the continued private hoarding of gold and silver by subjects of the United States poses a grave threat to the peace, equal justice, and well-being of the United States; and that appropriate measures must be taken immediately to protect the interests of our people. ''Therefore, pursuant to the above authority, I hereby proclaim that such gold and silver holdings are prohibited, and that all such coin, bullion or other possessions of gold and silver be tendered within fourteen days to agents of the Government of the United States for compensation at the official price, in the legal tender of the Government. All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been ************sealed************

...'Your possession of these proscribed metals and/or your maintenance of a safedeposit box to store them is known to the government from bank and insurance records. Therefore, be advised that your vault box must remain sealed, and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the Internal Revenue Service. ''By lawful Order given this day, the President of the United States.''

Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Sat, 14th Feb '09 9:33 PM

Dave Ramsey discourages buying gold as an investment. The above post is not the reason he gives for his belief. To me it seemed somewhat wise - even foolproof (though I have not done so).

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

This is the first time I've ever cried at the passing of a bill. I am nauseated at my beloved United States becoming this vulnerable. (And I don't believe it had to be this way.) I'm only writing these 2 posts to encourage you to protect yourself - but so you know that there are certain ways you may think you're protecting yourself that may not turn out the way you hoped.

Which says:

Federal obligations exceed world GDP

As the Obama administration pushes through Congress its $800 billion deficit-spending economic stimulus plan, the American public is largely unaware that the true deficit of the federal government already is measured in trillions of dollars, and in fact its $65.5 trillion in total obligations exceeds the gross domestic product of the world. The total U.S. obligations, including Social Security and Medicare benefits to be paid in the future...

****effectively have placed the U.S. government in bankruptcy****

...even before new continuing social welfare obligation embedded in the massive spending plan are taken into account. The real 2008 federal budget deficit was $5.1 trillion, not the $455 billion previously reported by the Congressional Budget Office, according to the "2008 Financial Report of the United States Government" as released by the U.S. Department of Treasury....

..."The federal government's deficit is hemorrhaging at a pace which threatens the viability of the financial system," Williams added. "The popularly reported 2009 [deficit] will clearly exceed $2 trillion on a cash basis and that full amount has to be funded by Treasury borrowing. "It's not likely this will happen without the Federal Reserve acting as lender of last resort for the Treasury by buying Treasury debt and monetizing the debt," he said. "Monetizing the debt" is a term used to signify that the Federal Reserve will be required simply to print cash to meet the Treasury debt obligations, acting in this capacity only because the Treasury cannot sell the huge of amount debt elsewhere.

The Treasury has been largely dependent upon foreign buyers, principally China and Japan and other major holders of U.S. dollar foreign exchange reserves, including OPEC buyers purchasing U.S. debt through London.

"The appetite of foreign buyers to purchase continued trillions of U.S. debt has become more questionable as the world has witnessed the rapid deterioration of the U.S. fiscal condition in the current financial crisis," Williams noted.

Salzypat  (Level: 154.3 - Posts: 5295)
Sat, 14th Feb '09 10:24 PM

I knew about the gold confiscation only because when my grandmother died in 1962 she had several gold coins in her possession and the family talked about how those were supposed to have been turned in back in the 1930s. I think they were $20 gold coins but I'm not sure.

I don't know whatever happened to them. I think my one aunt took them and since she has been dead many years, it's hard to tell where they are now.

Allena  (Level: 253.5 - Posts: 1388)
Sun, 15th Feb '09 12:14 AM

Gold porfits are heavily taxed because unlike stocks, which receive a maximum 15% tax rate on long-term gains, profits from trading bullion (bars or coins made of gold) are treated as "collectibles" by the Internal Revenue Service and get taxed at almost double the rate.

And although the GLD trades like a stock, it gets caught in the tax trap because it is backed up by holdings of gold bars, along with gold coins such as the American Eagle and the internationally popular South African krugerrand.

Kaufman  (Level: 253.8 - Posts: 3936)
Sun, 15th Feb '09 8:41 AM

As you know I'm horribly naive about such things, but I was first aware of the price of gold when it spiked way back in the early-to-mid 70s. And they always said the price of gold was behaving in inverse reaction to the value of the dollar. Gold goes up, the dollar was going down. Dollar rises, it was the gold that dropped. Sort of makes sense.

So anyways, I see absolutely nothing wrong with the private ownership of gold, and I certainly have no problem with owning gold things and coins because you like them (we have plenty), but when you buy gold as an investment, when you hope and work for the price of it to go up, you're basically cheering for the collapse of your local currency. Isn't that a wee bit unpatriotic?

Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Sun, 15th Feb '09 9:11 AM

No - I don't think that's the bottom line. The people I know buying gold aren't buying it as that kind of investment.

Their bottom line is IF the dollar collapses, their family has something to fall back on that has some worth.

But if the government can, at the stroke of a pen, demand the gold you've bought to protect your family, then there's no protection anyway.

Salzypat  (Level: 154.3 - Posts: 5295)
Sun, 15th Feb '09 4:15 PM

Is that law still in effect? Can't imagine it is with all the gold coins, etc., you can buy now.

Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Sun, 15th Feb '09 4:30 PM

Which reads:

Excerpt from "THE HISTORY OF GOLD":

The Gold Seizure Act of 1933 was passed. This act made it illegal for American citizens to own any gold. All gold had to be turned it to the Federal Reserve banks. It was purchased for $20.67 an ounce by the banks. If you were caught with gold in your posession, you faced a $10,000 fine and 5 years in prison.

It remained illegal for U.S. citizens to own any gold from1933 to 1974 when this act was abolished.

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