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bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 7:42 AM

FAMILY VALUES WHAT DO YOU THINK?

What a paradox for Gov. Mark Sanford. First, his vocal opposition to taking federal stimulus which caused him an stringent court fight over it; which he lost. The past several Days the governor went missing. Yep, that's right. Not a peep or tweet was heard from Gov. Sanford he was incommunicado-- AWOL. The lieutenant governor didn't know his whereabouts, a spokesperson for the gov and neither did a state senator who is a close confidante. Even Gov. Mark Sanford's WIFE didn't know his whereabouts. Next, it was purported the Gov was seen boarding a plane in Atlanta. What's it gonna be be for the Gov? What's even more worst, Gov. Mark Sanford disappearance is neither unusual nor out of character, according to one of his former associates. What???? With the incessant chanting of President Obama is making this country less safe, this is a hypocritical move for the head of South Carolina. After all, who’s gonna be around should one extremists decide to hit his state?

So when you talk about family values, one need is to note this past Sunday was Father's Day and National Hike Naked Day. Imagine that; a puritanical governor hiking naked! A member of a party which shrills “Family Values” should be at least with his kids and wife, I think on Father's Day. Let's see the Party of Family Values (Republicans) have Senator John Ensign (married with an extramarital affair), Senator Larry Craig (soliciting gay sex in a bathe room, Senator David Bruce Vitter (another adulterer). Don’t get me wrong now; I’m not condemning the gay movement; just the hypocritical Right Wing Dings who condemn the gay life style.

So there you have it; marital infidelity, gay sex, no problem literally for hypocrites. Since Gov Sanford has this proclivity for going AWOL how dare him and the rest of the Right Wing Ding obstructionists to accuse the President of the United Sates of America um, um, um, what’s the word I’m looking for? Okay, I've got it "Slowdown". That’s right; Right Wing Dings accuse President Obama of bringing the government to a halt and a "Washington Takeover".

I say Gov. Sanford cover your tracks, enjoy the scenery, and take another hike with your righteous superiority at the very worst.
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/06/report_sanford_seen_in_atlanta_airport.php




caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 7:50 AM

What do I think? I think whatever Governor Sanford does has not a damn thing to do with me just as how "Hollow" Michael Steele seems to many or the audacity of Palin speaking out against Letterman's not funny joke Interested in just how it affects you personally?

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 7:55 AM

Hi Linda

Did you miss my rants yesterday? I was busy out fight for us seniors. Anyhow, I find it strange the only thing that seems to affect you is President Obama's actions. By the way, there is going to be a public option for your healthcare. You do have choice there.


caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 8:07 AM

He said yesterday that nothing was set in stone except that people without coverage or with less coverage must have health care. The public option is not set in stone. Just for the record-Obama played golf on Father's Day and it was Sunday and he and family did not attend church, I don't play golf and neither do I attend church so consider that none of my business. Do consider pretending to be something when not or making up numbers indeed my busines http://emac.blogs.foxbusiness.com/2009/06/23/health-care-myths/

jank0614
Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 8:28 AM

Those sneaky governors!

Beverly - you missed this one about the Democrat Governor of Virginia:

http://www.roanoke.com/editorials/wb/209330

"Editorial: Where did Gov. Kaine go?

The governor should release records of his travel for the DNC.

When Gov. Tim Kaine started moonlighting as chairman of the Democratic National Committee, he promised his night job would not hinder his day job in Richmond. He should prove it by releasing travel records and information about who is footing the bill for his trips.

The administration indicated it probably would deny the request (for records of where he had been), citing two reasons.

1. When it comes to taxpayer-funded security, officials claim that revealing details could endanger the governor.

2. Security concerns might be convincing if this were not the first time the administration has raised them regarding the governor's travel schedule. When he headed overseas on trade missions in the past, the governor's team trumpeted his itinerary in press releases.

Nevertheless, the governor has a duty to Virginians beyond just the letter of FOIA. The only way the public can verify that his moonlighting has not interfered with his gubernatorial responsibilities is if it knows where and when he traveled and on whose dime. If big Democratic donors who have business before state agencies have provided free flights, people ought to know."

I got that one from a family member who lives in Roanoke. I just didn't know the sploofus family cared about governors of states where they don't live and who don't affect them at all. But since you do, I just wanted you to have the chance to be informed fully. Virginia is a whole lot closer to D.C. and much more vulnerable to terrorist attack than S.C.

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 8:30 AM

It's gonna be public option because 72% of Americans want it. He wants to win for you ,me, and Americans. As far as Sundays and Church, Synagogue, Temple, Dungeon or whatever, you don't have to be there physically to believe. Look at me I ascribe to no religion and am a good person. I really don't think President is supposed to be a holy roller! Balance is very important in life. At least President Obama was not jogging naked on Father's Day.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 8:42 AM

Your stratedy attack the messenger not defend what you believe . Covering everyone "Sounds" good and when when asked most people because it is their nature to think of the unfortunate say they support a public option. If it can be properly disclosed exactly what the public option migh mean for those already covered by a private pla nmight be different. If DPS had been given the option of a cheaper plan because a gvernment plan can be as it has unlimited resources funded by taxpayer that is what I would have and it would SUCK . NO lines drawn in the sand http://www.foxbusiness.com/story/markets/industries/finance/obama-line-sand-govt-healthcare-plan/

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 9:06 AM

Janice
Those governors really do surprise us everyday. Wonders never cease. Look at Blogveich a true nut case

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 9:10 AM

The take over you talk about is a misnomer. Private plans will be able to compete too. Also, it's our civic duty to pay taxes.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 9:28 AM

Then why doesn't EVERYONE pay them? Makes sense to me that a government plan has unlimited resources so he is not going to take my health car away the next day after anything is/If is passed. It will be a gradual push out of private insurers starting with the small ones just like he started with the auto deaerships not the "BIGGIE'" Chysler composed of UAW workers - Waiting to see if he is bogus enough to endorse taxing health care benefits with something wriiten in to exclude contracts already negotiated pror to a given date. That would pass card check without there ever being a vote on it as it would protect union members-large part of his support base.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 9:44 AM

Lotta leaps of faith in your post, Beverly.

Unless you live in SC, I don't think this affects any of us. And if the Lt Gov was advised of his absence, it's no big deal for anyone.

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 10:58 AM

Gov Mark Sanford has been found. He wasn’t hiking naked in the Appalachian Trail He was in Buenos Aires, Argentina. I just hope for his sake it was not with a mistress, intern, prostitute, or male page. Personally, I could care very little about either. I care about liars who aspire to run for the highest office in America. I think Gov Sanford just blew his chance for presidency.


Linda,
We bailed out the auto industry to help the economy; how fast do you see your money turn over? So Medicare and Medicaid comes out of your taxes but we put our tax dollars into the FICA really , I see no take over; rather a plan to give the people who deserve health care. I do watch Krauthmather, I just don't always agree with him. By the time he comes on it is refreshing to listen to some one who isn't stupid.

Any terrorist attack affects all Americans because we stand together in the way. Just like we did with 9-11. We may not agree on all things but we are ONE when comes to attacks on our soil.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:18 AM

I'm glad Governor Sanford has been found and think it nice that you are hopeful he was not with a mistress. Personaly, I don't give a damn any more than the fact that Obama is still a smoker. Know from experience it is a horrible thing to quit. Also know there is no such thing for me as 95% cured. If I smoke one cigarette it will be 2 packs by days end regardlees of labels, warnings, and costs. Have known a few-very few- people who could be occasional smokers perhaps he is one but that too speaks to when someone takes a picture

fudypatootie
Fudypatootie  (Level: 197.3 - Posts: 1302)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:21 AM

I love that the president talks out both sides of his mouth. First he says that the largest debt-making portion of the federal budget is health care, ie. Medicare, which many people feel does not work well. Then he says there will be a public option, which will be the federal government running health care, and how is that different from Medicare? If they can't get Medicare right, how do we expect them to get MORE federal health care right?

And this plan won't even cover the "everyone" that he is so concerned about. It will cover something like 13% of the currently uninsured. That's everyone??

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:22 AM

Think a huge problem consuming our country for some time is the idea that people DESERVE not have to EARN something?

fudypatootie
Fudypatootie  (Level: 197.3 - Posts: 1302)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:22 AM

Oh, and what does the governor going off for some quality alone time have to do with family values?

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:42 AM

One would just have to hope he is not lighting up in or on government property ! LOL

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:45 AM

Well, Fuddy

Like I said earlier family values is.... that on those days especially Father's Day he should have been with his family. If his children had a surprise for him they're probably disappointed.


It depends, also on what he was doing in Argentina .Was it the tango, mistress, intern, prostitute, or male page, whatever; that scandal is going to affect his so-called puritanical family values and his kids.


fudypatootie
Fudypatootie  (Level: 197.3 - Posts: 1302)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:48 AM

Every family celebrates holidays differently. Some don't make big deals out of those "holidays" while others do. Maybe his family knew he was planning on getting away and that was their present to him. We don't know is my point.

That's not to say that it was the best way to take a vacation, but after all the crap his state has put him through, maybe he thought turnabout was fair play. I still don't think it has anything to do with family values.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 11:50 AM

Smoking affects us alll-second hand smoke rising health care costs blah blah blah-don't give a damn about Sanford's poitical,l career nor Obama's smoking-find it interesting that you seem obsessed with anyone who criticizes Obama but that is just me

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 1:01 PM

fuddy

Regardless, of how the family celebrates, his children will ill-benefit from this highly publicized adventure.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 1:18 PM

You mean like the possible ill effects on Chelsea Clinton??

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 1:21 PM

Beverly, it seems that you might be replaying the 1988 or 1992 election.

FYI it's 2009, we just had an election and it's time to govern.

Furthermore you should feel ashamed of all the silly suggestions and auccsations you made about the governor above.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 1:21 PM

Beverly, it seems that you might be replaying the 1988 or 1992 election.

FYI it's 2009, we just had an election and it's time to govern.

Furthermore you should feel ashamed of all the silly suggestions and accusations you made about the governor above.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 1:21 PM

Sanford s supposed to have a press conference at 2 pm so you want to tune in to FOX. Be sure you don't miss anything to indicate he is lying. We aLL know politicians don't LIE LOL

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 2:50 PM

Well, you were correct, Beverly in suspecting the worst. His press conference was the most open and forthright I have heard in a very long time. Where he goes or doesn't go as far as his public life and his maarige are concernened don't believe folks have a clue. Am sure of ONE thing though you and others like you will point out all that is evil and hypocritical about him. Linda

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:01 PM

Gov Sanford just admitted he had an affair with someone.He didn't say man, woman, child, trans-sexual, or transvesite. ( just trying to inject a little humor in a sad situation) He teared up; bu,t he told the truth after lying.

I must say I really feel so sorry for Gov Sanford. I guess this should be a lesson for him. People how think themselves morally and politically superior shouldn't through rocks at those they consider beneath him. I mean this is what I consider bad karma as well as lesson to be learned and taught. Maybe now the republicans will know see their condemnation for others unlike them negates inclusion. Republican numbers wouldn't be so low and would be more attractive if hypocrisy didn't continue so prevalently in their ideology and party. He's a married man; yes, Linda, he lied. He's human. We are all human. We are all the same. We are human beings prone to mistakes and that includes President Obama.

I hope Gov Sanford finds comfort in whatever he chooses to do.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:05 PM

The conference was actually a bit painful to watch. Probably a smart politician would not have given so many details and made a statement and not taken questions.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:07 PM

Whew, Beverly, I can't tell you how relieved I am to learn he didn't go hiking naked.

FYI, if you didn't know it before, politicians tend to be rather sexy.

tsk9653
Tsk9653  (Level: 113.2 - Posts: 1466)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:16 PM

Who says every topic has to personally impact you to be deemed legitimate? Anyway, Sanford has been mentioned as a possible presidential candidate so everybody should have this information, among other information, for the purpose of assessing whether Sanford should be considered for president.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:19 PM

He said a WOMAN So many politicians have survived sexual misconduct-look at Clinton . His detailed conference included detail which people really don't need to know and because it was obviously a difficult place for him personally to be, made him seem a bit not disciplined enough to govern-perhaps that will change . Would have been fascinating to have the internet and bloggers covering our history's past politicians or "Leaders" in general -Linda

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:21 PM

I would not go far as to say it's evil. I did notice after his press conference a dark cloud came over the section where I live in my city and it started raining cat's and dogs. I'm not sure what kind of omen that is. Evil, It could be? I will say it's hypocritical to have condescension towards others. Republicans are getting a healthy dose of reality.The Party of Family Values Republicans now have Senator John Ensign, Senator Larry Craig , Senator David Vitter, and Sarah Palin who have huge mea cuppas . I’m also saying this hypocrisy is too obvious. Agree?

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:28 PM

And... you will ALWAYS have Clinton twice

fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:29 PM

Bigmama, or BM, I think that it is ridiculous that you would use the story of the governor to try to overshadow Obama's miserable job as Pres. I mean, how far will you go to try to build the man up? It's simply ridiculous and transparent.



caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:31 PM

Just think it would be revealing to examine past politicians and leaders with the abilities now avaialable to scrutinize their behavior

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:33 PM

No, not Clinton twice because we can and we will get heath care reform.

fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:33 PM

See, BM, everyone makes mistakes. At least the GOP stands for something positive. See, I think it's better to set a high standard and not make it than be a liberal and have no standards at all. Except socialism, of course.

fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:35 PM

yeah, the health care thing, if it passes, will be a severely watered down version, but of course, Obama will claim victory anyway. Again, as was pointed out by someone smarter than me (or you, for that matter), Medicare doesn't work, why would another government-run health care program work?

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:43 PM

Socalism? This country is not socialist. I suggest you look up the definition of this republic.

Are you prepared for you fall from grace? My liberal heart will forgive you


fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:45 PM

Hon, we haven't been a republic in a long time. And my point was that libs WANT socialism, not that we're necessarly there now, although quickly heading towards, thanks to your god, Obama.

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:53 PM

I don't have a god; but; I do believe in our President. I'm a free thinker. Speaking of which, since Regan and the Bushwackers et al, it would appear any one could be a god compared to that hell. I'm glad you realize we are are still a democracy. I think we agree on that.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 3:58 PM

Well, Faino, I for one would like to see a watered-down version that we can afford pass, maybe with an implementation date down the road a ways. We do need to improve access to health care for the less fortunate.

fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 4:00 PM

BM said

I don't have a god;

Really? You sure fooled me.

I'm a free thinker.

Whatever.

Speaking of which, since Regan and the Bushwackers et al, it would appear any one could be a god compared to that hell.

Yeah, Reagan was so horrible. That's why he won 49 states in '84.

I'm glad you realize we are are still a democracy.

Barely. And BTW, a democracy and a republic are not quite the same thing.

I think we agree on that.

I'd rather have a colonoscopy than EVER agree with your political views.


jank0614
Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 4:23 PM

Now that there has been the press conference, and to return to the subject of the thread, now we know the truth, which is hopefully what is the goal of all of our searches.

The guy is guilty, and having made the case for family values, he further demeans the goal and conservative platform. I agree, though, that it is a valiant and courageous goal to have.

Each of the people who has been listed in this thread as having failed the goal of morality has a responsibility of bringing condemnation upon the goal and the cause. (How Palin ended in that list, I have no idea. The governor herself has not had a moral failure that I know of.)

There is no excuse for any of us who would shoot for a righteous goal, yet fail it. However, at least we HAVE a goal.

What I pray every morning in my attempt to keep the goal firmly in front of me is spelled out in a Bible group thread. And yet, I fight every day. My personal failings may be different from the governor's, but they are just a grievous to God - every miss of the mark (as in archery) is sin. Period. My sins are not spelled out in a press conference or in Argentina. But they are spelled out to my God and they are damaging in their own way and they hurt my heart very much. The Bible even says that for a person to know a thing to do and not to do it - to that person THAT is sin. I passed a 20s-ish man on the long highway Monday, in 98 degree weather. He was walking. He had no luggage, but it was a far distance to anywhere. Why was he there? It was too hot for anyone to be out walking and it was dangerous with all the trucks whizzing by to even be walking there.

And yet, I have enough fear as a woman alone in a vehicle to not pull over and offer him a ride. And it bothered me for miles (and obviously still does). I've heard no news items that the person was hit or anything like that. I prayed for someone else, a man, to pick him up. I hope that happened. But since I was the one driving by, should it have been I who stopped and picked him up?

Practically everyone subscribes to the "it's better to have loved and lost than to never have loved at all." But many do not apply that to the reality of setting a goal of morality. I don't know what will happen in SC but I do believe the 2012 candidacy is now a dead issue for the governor. I did not know anything about him, so I am not affected by that loss.

The governor does, however, have a wife and 4 sons whose lives are forever changed by this man's actions, and nothing I feel could begin to touch the hem of the garment of their pain and disappointment and embarrassment and anger, working through all the feelings of such a life-changing event.

I hate that our last memories of so many people are twisted when we'd rather have been allowed to keep an untarnished opinion of that person.

I don't think there are any excuses. Beverly nailed it here, though she didn't even know the truth when she posted.

Do I want conservatives or republicans or Christians or religious people or good people or politicians or whomever to stop setting the goal of a moral life, a loving mom and dad married before they bear children, no more STDs because people only are intimate with one person? No. I think it's a worthy goal and one that all children deserve. There are many moral goals I think are worthy and I don't think we should stop holding them high, no matter how many of us fall short or how often.

And yes, as long as many of us believe in the goal, and as long as there are many of us who fall short, there will be no end to the number of people right there to yell "hypocrite."

But it doesn't make the goal wrong. And I'm not sure it makes the people yelling "hypocrite" feel any better about themselves in the middle of the night when their own failings come to haunt.

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 4:45 PM

Fainodraino
You should be taking your barium enema right about now because all your s#** is coming down.

To glorify a man who took this country into the direction which has caused more poverty with his massive tax cuts is sacrilegious. Unless you are a war profiteer, I suggest you not glorify an old man couldn’t even walk up or down the steps of an airplane without falling down or read his crib cards. Those were clues that we had a man with Alzheimer running the government. Don’t forget Enron and Mci/Worldcom, people losing their life savings, just as they have then and now; thanks to the Bushwhackers. Of course, deregulation was wonderful; but, the bubble burst and look at what we have now; decades of mismanagement and outstanding debt, thanks to your glorious old puppet and actor to the rich, fat cats.
Please don't give me this tear this wall down speech either. Maybe you need another lesson in history. You can't compare Iran to his immortalized words. Iran remembers what the United States did to their Shia after they left Sadeem in Power.


caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 4:49 PM

Should we check the FBI past records? Interesting stuff on marital fidelity and all on past LEADERS" but guess most of that material has been lost or burned

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:03 PM

You need a break, Beverly. That partisan dogma is really getting you down

Reagan was one of the better and more accomplished Presidents of the 20th century. From a deep recession left by Clueless Jimmy ('member the misery index?) launched a huge expansion of our economy, put the final stake through the heart of Russian communism . . .

jank0614
Jank0614  (Level: 67.1 - Posts: 4597)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:10 PM

That kind of uninformed, inflamatory, and inaccurate rhetoric astonishes me - especially in light of the fact that the FACTS are so easy to find and prove on the internet. There's no way to get away with such inaccuracies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaganomics (and I just use wiki cause it comes up first, but when you go through the first hundred entries in google you'll find more sites. Facts and facts and no amount of blind misstatement will change them.

"According to a 1996 study from the libertarian think tank Cato Institute:

On 8 of the 10 key economic variables examined, the American economy performed better during the Reagan years than during the pre- and post-Reagan years.

Real median family income grew by $4,000 during the Reagan period after experiencing no growth in the pre-Reagan years; it experienced a loss of almost $1,500 in the post-Reagan years.

Interest rates, inflation, and unemployment fell faster under Reagan than they did immediately before or after his presidency.

The only economic variable that was worse in the Reagan period than in both the pre- and post-Reagan years was the savings rate, which fell rapidly in the 1980s."

"In the last year of the Carter Administration (1980) the US inflation rate climbed to a peak of 14.8%, the top individual tax payer rate was 78%, unemployment was 7.4%, federal outlay was 17% higher than the economy's growth rate, and the federal government grew while enacting loads of new spending programs. During this period, the US economy was the worst it had been since the Great Depression of the 1930s. The nation was in quite a deep hole of economic collapse when the new president Ronald Reagan took office in January 1981."

****(I personally had a VA house mortgage at 16 3/4% in 1980).

"Stephen Moore of the Cato Institute stated that "no act in the last quarter century had a more profound impact on the US economy of the eighties and nineties than the Reagan tax cut of 1981." He claims that Reagan's tax cuts, combined with an emphasis on federal monetary policy, deregulation, and expansion of free trade created a sustained economic expansion creating America's greatest sustained wave of prosperity ever. The American economy grew by more than a third in size, producing a $15 trillion increase in American wealth.

EVERY INCOME GROUP, from the richest, middle class and poorest in this country, grew its income (1981-1989). Consumer and investor confidence soared. Cutting federal income taxes, cutting the US government spending budget, cutting useless programs, scaling down the government work force, maintaining low interest rates, and keeping a watchful inflation hedge on the monetary supply was Ronald Reagan's formula for a successful economic turnaround. "



bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:13 PM

Janice you did the right thing; he could have been trouble; thoughts are things. I'm hoping that person is okay now despite whatever his reason for walking in the hot sun was.
___________________________------------------------------------------------------------___________________________
"But it doesn't make the goal wrong. And I'm not sure it makes the people yelling "hypocrite" feel any better about themselves in the middle of the night when their own failings come to haunt".

Janice
I myself do not take great delight in the suffering of another. If I could help him spiritually, I would. As I said before I feel a tremendous amount of empathy for the governor and his family. I just heard his wife has come forth acknowledging that see asked him to leave In hopes of a reconciliation. I wish him the best of luck in his personal life and politically, I hope all politicians take a look at how hypocrisy affects their actions and the people they represent whether it be a small district or the President of a country.

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:30 PM


My point was-- yea the time was wonderful, but the bubble burst due to deregulation and tax cuts which people feel the effect of now.. Cato is a not a non-partisan orginization.

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:51 PM

bless your heart, Beverly

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:54 PM

Are you serious?

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:59 PM

I was hoping you had read the Religion Group thread and then you would "Get" my drift

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:59 PM

I was hoping you had read the Religion Group thread and then you would "Get" my drift

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 5:59 PM

I was hoping you had read the Religion Group thread and then you would "Get" my drift

fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 6:20 PM

Hey BM, I think everyone else proved my point.

And thanks for the cursing. It really lightens things up (and shows your true colors).

fudypatootie
Fudypatootie  (Level: 197.3 - Posts: 1302)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 6:32 PM

Big Mama, I was going to give you a because you were right about Sandford and I was wrong, but I think I also have to give you a and maybe even a after the way you went on the attack against Fainodraino. You two should agree to disagree, but your name-calling is unneeded.

kaufman
Kaufman  (Level: 257.0 - Posts: 3936)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 6:50 PM

This just shows what an incredible politician John Ensign is. Unlike the many from both sides of the aisle, and Sanford joins this illustrious crowd, whose affairs' circumstances are truly comical and/or outrageous, his was disgustingly vanilla. How rare is that!


fudypatootie
Fudypatootie  (Level: 197.3 - Posts: 1302)
Wed, 24th Jun '09 6:59 PM

I just read an interesting article in More magazine about politicians having affairs. One of the more compelling arguments for why it's so common is that these men are in one of the most public, stressful positions out there, yet seeing a counselor or psychiatrist for the stress is seen as a stigma in our society.

Not that I think there's any excuse for this type of behavior, just an interesting theory.

salzypat
Salzypat  (Level: 156.5 - Posts: 5316)
Thu, 25th Jun '09 11:18 AM

Anyone remember Gary Hart?

Evidently Gov. Sanford doesn't either or he wouldn't have repeated Hart's mistake..

bigmama60
Bigmama60  (Level: 95.2 - Posts: 6648)
Thu, 25th Jun '09 11:27 AM

Fuddy

I was only defending myself. Fainodraino accused me of being crap. These politicians take a vow when they are married; I know temptation abounds everywhere. I just think they shouldn't bring their personal lives into politics.

sandracam
Sandracam  (Level: 149.3 - Posts: 4190)
Thu, 25th Jun '09 11:30 AM

h-y-p-o-c-r-i-t-e

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Thu, 25th Jun '09 4:37 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A878204 This guy is "Toast' because of the platform he ran on and the fact that he is not popular in his own party. Just find it interesting that even FOX is referring to the "Other Woman' as his mistress. Was Monica Lewinski Clinton's mistress? I doubt anyone would even classify that one on his part as an affair.. I have always thought the word mistress in a sexual context impliecd some kind of support like rent paid and so on. The current facts seem to be this governor had an Affair not that he kept a mistress. I am not defending anything as things are what they are. Hate this nasty/sneaky twist on language to make people look good or bad though Linda

fainodraino
Fainodraino  (Level: 113.1 - Posts: 240)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 12:50 AM

Most politicians have affairs and are untrustworthy. Sanford is no different. The only thing is that he has preached against it before, and therefore, that gives the left something to jump on. Let's not forget that the left has had plenty of scandals, just like the right. Edwards, Clinton, etc.

Let's face it. Politicians, in general, suck.

madamec8
Madamec8  (Level: 82.6 - Posts: 893)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 5:20 AM

I think it's ridiculous to use a person's personal life to score political points. The opening post set the tone.

Family Values is a subjective term. It comes in handy in politics. Why this affair gets so much attention and energy is beyond me. We have real problems in this country.

I just received the nastiest and most disgusting email about the Republican party using the governor as a starting point . I won't post it here, this forum is above that. The ugly hatred running through the message really says more about the person who wrote it. I felt like I needed a shower after reading it.

I hope we don't let our forum drop to that level. 'Before you accuse me, take a look at yourself.'

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 6:01 AM

Yes, it Is Madame, But this guy hafd voted to impeasch Clinton because of Clinton's sexual "indiscretions" Believe that is a big reason why it was used against him as he made his moral position of extramartial things was a part of his platform . He used Clinton's lack of marality as the basis for demanding impeachment not the many other things wrong with Clinton. For me the issue was although I believed his press thing sincere wheras never believed Clinton was sincere in any of his remorse, was his rather rambling detaiil while trying to explain his actions made questionable his ability to govern Outside of this liked hi stance on fiscal discipline and the rest and sorry that he had put the other stuff so out front to the point he is now "Dead Meat" There is also the issue that he left his state unattended with no one in charge. The point of my post a couple up was that wth Clinton and the Words can make it seem although unsavory like with Clinton often using the word "indescretion" but this guy with no facts now has a Mistress."

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 6:06 AM

Clinton as the chief law enforcement executive in the land knowingly lied in a deposition, contrary to the advice of his lawyer who advised him he would be impeached. And so he was.

madamec8
Madamec8  (Level: 82.6 - Posts: 893)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 7:08 AM

I thought Clinton should have been impeached because he was stupid I hadn't heard his attorney advised him about not lying in the deposition, lest he be impeached. If so, he was doubly stupid.

Re the Paula Jones case -- interesting that the case was thrown out and would have been whether Clinton told the truth or not. His testimony was given during discovery, I'm thinking his greatest fear was of his wife's reaction. Outcome was the same, wasn't it.

Plenty of hypocrisy to go around -- especially Henry the homewrecker Hyde.

madamec8
Madamec8  (Level: 82.6 - Posts: 893)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 7:24 AM

Linda, I understand what you mean -- guess I should have worded it better -- Clinton's impeachment (and remember he wasn't convicted) is a dead horse. Why waste time and energy politicking over the gov. as payback?

I'm surprised ... and glad ... nobody's trotted hizzonor Blago

caramel1
Caramel1  (Level: 128.3 - Posts: 21602)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 7:27 AM

Mhy point was that Sanford made a moral judgment against cCinton bt voting for impeachment. Whether that moral judgement had to do with the sexual exploits or the lying i strongly suspec the former-it is still a moral judgement. Sanford has had sexual expolits and at some point lied to his wife at least at some point and perhapers the peolpe who worked forfhim as to his whereabouts. You cannot be a candidate running for president when you put what you believe is "moral" out there and then violate them-makes you look like a hypocrite which is what people are calling him If he had left the private things where they should be and stuck to his beliegs on what part the Feds should play or not play in things, he might have been a viable candidate

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 7:47 AM

Thrown out, Colleen?

I rather think settled for a hefty sum paid to that pig of a woman from Arkieville.

At least JFK had good taste!

madamec8
Madamec8  (Level: 82.6 - Posts: 893)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 10:01 AM

Andy, I was talking specifically about Judge Wright's dismissal of the case when Clinton's attorneys asked for a summary judgement -- looking at time line helps

In August 1997 Judge Wright set a trial date for the following May, but dismissed the claim that Clinton had defamed Jones.

January 1998 Clinton was deposed by Paula Jones' attorneys. That was the pivotal point. He denied he had had sexual relations with Monica Lewinsky.

In April Judge Wright granted Clinton's request for summary judgement, and agreed that Jones had failed to produce evidence of harassment or workplace discrimination.

Two weeks later Jones said she was going to appeal the ruling.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.9 - Posts: 9952)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 1:16 PM

I concede and don't remember the details -

and now I know more about you!

nanpaulhus
Nanpaulhus  (Level: 139.1 - Posts: 340)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 3:22 PM

I'm just glad I believe that God is in control and he allows into power whom He will. When the people of Israel clamored for a king, he allowed it, even thought not in their best interest. We vote, and God allows certain things. Sometimes we then repent, or even - once in a blue moon - we boast. While I am serious about politics and government, I won't allow it to ruin my dinner nor my sleep. This may not be a popular opinion, but ladies and gents, it's really not worth fighting over nor losing friends over. Let our words spoken be like "apples of gold in pictures (frames) of silver".

madamec8
Madamec8  (Level: 82.6 - Posts: 893)
Fri, 26th Jun '09 3:28 PM

You know more about me? I did NOT have sex with that president Hey, we're all learning something, and sometimes I have to go back and make sure my memory was OK

Actually I hit the post button prematurely -- here's a bit more:

In November of that year Clinton agreed to pay Jones $850,000 to drop the case. I guess that was settlement, I thought of it as hush money, she had some powerful legal representation. So, that's the Jones civil case.

Ken Starr decided to pursue the matter further and called Clinton before the Grand Jury. Clinton was boxed in -- if he told the truth to the Grand Jury, then he'd be guilty of perjury in the Paula Jones case. He had affidavits from Monica Lewinsky supporting his testimony, and did what most people would likely have done, he lied to the Grand Jury .... and OOPS, here comes the blue dress.

The moral of the story -- telling the truth the first go-around would not have gotten him impeached. Should have remembered Watergate -- it wasn't the break-in, it was the cover-up that brought down the Nixon presidency.



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