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baggiob
Baggiob  (Level: 142.7 - Posts: 888)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 3:25 AM

WHATS WITH THE SHOWDONS

I would be interested to hear what you think about this.
WHy is it that when your showdown results in a stalemate and no points are won or lost that still goes down as a no win on your percentage.

Somebody could do 100 showdowns and not lose any or not win any (if they are all stalemates) and the percenatge would say 0%

Personally i think it would be a truer reflection if the stalemates were not included in the percentage.

I can understand the thinking that if the percentage is that of which you have won and a stalemate means you haven't won but the opposite is true, you also haven't lost when it is a stalmate.

What do you think?

pafork
Pafork  (Level: 132.0 - Posts: 537)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 4:07 AM

I agree. I've always thought stalemates shouldn't lower your showdown victory percentage.

larrybus
Larrybus  (Level: 307.8 - Posts: 383)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 5:14 AM

I agree, too. I think that a stalemate should either be considered 1/2 win and 1/2 loss or left out of the showdown calculation altogether.

vettage
Vettage  (Level: 41.0 - Posts: 241)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 6:04 AM

Agreed, toss the stalemates out of the equation.

berylm
Berylm  (Level: 156.6 - Posts: 478)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 6:32 AM

Me too.

violetblue
Violetblue  (Level: 112.2 - Posts: 850)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 10:19 AM

I have submitted a support ticket (or two) on this very issue. I thought Justin said he would look into it but I haven't done a showdown in a while so I couldn't tell if it had been changed.

I think it is wrong for a draw to be counted as a loss in terms of the "showdown percentage".

tuzilla
Tuzilla  (Level: 134.2 - Posts: 3779)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 11:53 AM

I just inventoried my Showdown History. I am 61 wins -- 61 Loses -- and 54 stalemates, if my quick count is accurate. My win percentage is listed as 34%.
Perhaps a fairer listing would be the win/lose/draw percentages or totals.

suzer22
Suzer22  (Level: 165.6 - Posts: 1982)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 12:14 PM

A win percentage is a win percentage...not necessarily a "not lost" percentage. The point of the statistic, for me, is to see the win percentage of others and decide if I like my odds going in against them. I would much rather have a stalemate than a loss...so I really only care about how often the other guy WINS.
If they win 0% of the time then I am pretty sure of winning if I can get the answer correct, or at least sure to NOT lose any points if I get it wrong. When I see a win % of over 75% I won't challenge them because they are winning a lot more than they are stalemating...and my chances of losing points are greatly increased, even if I do get the answer correct.

I'm not sure if this logic makes sense to anyone else, but I want the stat to stay the same. It's not about my vanity at having a good percentage, but what I need to know about other people's answering ability.

The stat I wonder about is 'average answering speed'. Does that include TQOTD AND showdowns? I tend to take more time and feel less pressured on TQOTD...I do not go for speed the way I would on a showdown.

baggiob
Baggiob  (Level: 142.7 - Posts: 888)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 12:18 PM

suzer22 i understand you totally, but if the % was just for wins it would give you a better idea of how well they do.
someone with a 75 % just now may have actually never lost a showdown so it should read 100%.

missashlee
Missashlee  (Level: 125.6 - Posts: 543)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 1:54 PM

I think the only way to get a 'stalemate' is when both parties miss the question, unless there can be a tie in the time for both to answer correctly.

So, a stalemate indicates a missed question. I do look at the percentage, like Suzer says, before I challenge and use it as an indicator of how often the person gets the question right.

But you can win if you miss the question (challengee does not respond) and you can lose if you get the question right (slower)! That's happened to me more than once.

Don't know what the best statistic would be...????

sargon
Sargon  (Level: 112.0 - Posts: 1256)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 2:29 PM

When looking at a possible showdown opponent it is best to know what the probability is that you will lose points. The statistic as it stands gives a truer representation of how often the player has successfully given a correct answer in less time than the challenger.

The only way to present a better representation is to show wins-losses-draws.

suzer22
Suzer22  (Level: 165.6 - Posts: 1982)
Sun, 6th Aug '06 3:58 PM

Baggiob - I am still looking at that 75% as how like l am I to lose points, not how likely am I to win the showdown.

berylm
Berylm  (Level: 156.6 - Posts: 478)
Mon, 7th Aug '06 12:57 AM

Missashlee - not necessarily, you don't have to miss the question to have a stalemate, you can both get it wrong!

Suzer - your logic doesn't follow. Someone with a 75% win rate could have won 3 showdowns and just been on vacation and not logged on in time to pick up a challenge for the fourth (while the challenger got it wrong) - in other words, as someone else said, they actually have a 100% win rate (you are VERY likely to lose the points!!) - so the 75% is misleading.

If nothing else, there should be two figures given - wins and losses. The difference will be stalemates. That would be a much better indication, I think.

suzer22
Suzer22  (Level: 165.6 - Posts: 1982)
Mon, 7th Aug '06 1:50 AM

But there is always a chance that they will not log on for my challenge either! If they've done it once...it could happen again!

I stand by my stats!

I think you guys want the stat to be more like a baseball players' batting average, which has no reflection on how many times the batter has actually been up to bat. You have no idea how many times they hit to a sacrifice, or walked, or got hit by a pitch.

I DO want to know, out of EVERY time they have been up to bat, how many times do they get a hit! [fill in the showdown terms to this metaphor yourself]

missashlee
Missashlee  (Level: 125.6 - Posts: 543)
Mon, 7th Aug '06 2:23 AM

Berylm:

Thatís what I said: the "only way to get a 'stalemate' is when both parties miss the question"...

If someone has 10 stalemates, that means that person answered the question wrong in each of those 10 challenges!*

I want to know how often a potential challengee gets the question right (conversely, wrong).

Using Suzerís analogy, a stalemate is like a strike-out, not a walk!

- Jeanne

---------
*Okay, could have taken more than 30 seconds and missed...most often it is a wrong answer!


suzer22
Suzer22  (Level: 165.6 - Posts: 1982)
Mon, 7th Aug '06 11:08 AM

Also stalemate could occur when they don't answer at all. But so could an easy win!


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