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collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.8 - Posts: 9952)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 6:50 PM

I'M HAVING MATH PROBLEMS WP

I had fun with this, but I was having math problem's two . Well, actually five. Every clue that said over or under seemed to be the opposite.

garrybl
Garrybl  (Level: 279.5 - Posts: 6639)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 7:23 PM

splendid puzzle; very imaginative. I see what colliure says; it took me a while to understand what the writer meant.... and I'm not sure I agree with his perspective but it did not make the problems much harder than they already were....

pepperdoc
Pepperdoc  (Level: 152.5 - Posts: 4286)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 7:32 PM

Nicely done, Sploofishy!

bbear
Bbear  (Level: 161.0 - Posts: 2301)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 7:53 PM

Absolutely one of the best ever. Just love the idea and not too hard but totally challenging. LOVE IT

marynuala
Marynuala  (Level: 133.5 - Posts: 994)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 8:54 PM

Diffucult one! But a very interesting and challenging puzzle.


m48ortal
M48ortal  (Level: 251.2 - Posts: 3742)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 9:02 PM

Darn it. As a math teacher, I was looking forward to this one. But my better half wanted to go antique shopping so I figured I'd do it this evening. We got back, the clock read 7:40, so I logged in to find "Bath Problems" instead. I forgot that since we're vacationing in the central time zone, it's really 8:40.

Kind of makes me glad I'm never among the monthly leaders. Hope it was fun.

digs
Digs  (Level: 116.6 - Posts: 812)
Thu, 18th Mar '10 10:40 PM

I agree with Bbear.........absolutely one of the best ever!
But I was also having the same problem as Collioure with the clues..........my over/unders seemed back to front
Apart from that I really, really enjoyed solving it.
A big thank you to Sploofishy, very clever.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.8 - Posts: 9952)
Fri, 19th Mar '10 5:30 AM

That's three of us who thought the math was backwards.

May we hear from the author and/or editor explaining an example where the math seems to be backwards?

kaufman
Kaufman  (Level: 256.8 - Posts: 3936)
Fri, 19th Mar '10 5:40 AM

Four of us, though I could see how in one view the generated answer would be one too high, and in another the correct answer would be. Do we see two silhouettes or a lamp? I'm just glad I resisted temptation after puzzle 1 to abort and send in a support ticket saying this doesn't add up!

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.8 - Posts: 9952)
Fri, 19th Mar '10 8:24 PM

Ken, I think we were too polite.

I'm going to stomp my feet until we get some attention.

alvandy
Alvandy  (Level: 229.3 - Posts: 7560)
Fri, 19th Mar '10 9:37 PM

Back in high school, I wasn't too proficient in trig or calculus, but I did well in general math.
Challenging puzzle indeed , but worth the effort to get my brain in gear again.
.

Sploofus Editor
Sploofishy (Editor)  
Sat, 20th Mar '10 4:42 PM

Not that this really matters since it was a level playing field for all, but here is how the math worked in the puzzle. I did not perceive that one could easily flip the incorrect answer given in the phrases for the correct mathematical answer (gee, that's not confusing at all, is it?). This accounts for the over/under confusion some had.

bowled perfectly plus sesqui centennial equals fahrenheit four fifty one ("Sum 1over (wrds 4&5 = 1 wrd)")
300 + 150 = 451 The given sum is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 450

fox networks twenty four divided by blackbirds in a pie equals tea for two ("Quotient over by 1")
24/24 = 2 The given quotient is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 1

bakers dozen plus us flag stripes equals silver wedding anniversary ("Sum short by 1")
13 + 13 = 25 The given sum is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 26

first odd prime number times ten commandments equals baskin robbins flavors ("Product over by 1")
3 * 10 = 31 The given product is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 30

magnesiums atomic number minus mount rushmore heads equals the film seven ("Difference under by 1")
12 - 4 = 7 The given difference is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 8

harry potter books minus books in the pentateuch equals a trilogy ("Difference over by 1")
7 - 5 = 3 The given difference is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 2

route sixty six divided by six pack abs equals number ten downing street ("Quotient under by 1")
66/6 = 10 The given quotient is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 11

vicks formula forty four times pepsi one equals colt forty five revolver ("Product over by 1")
44 * 1 = 45 The given product is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 44

four score and seven years plus thirty rock equals hundred years war length ("Sum over by 1 (no, not 17)")
87 + 30 = 117 The given sum is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 116

worlds longest surname minus fictional phone prefix equals miracle street ("Difference under by 1")
600 - 555 = 34 The given difference is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 35

I hope that this clears things up - although given the nature of people, mathematics, and the interaction between the two, I doubt that that will be the case.

But then, it's supposed to be a puzzle, isn't it?

kaufman
Kaufman  (Level: 256.8 - Posts: 3936)
Sat, 20th Mar '10 4:56 PM

And as I said, when I saw "sum over by 1", I interpreted it as "when you add the two numbers being added, it results in a number one higher than the desired answer, as given by the third term."

Though that was all window dressing. I don't think it cost me any moves. More troubling for my score was the fact that the first puzzle I got (when I was still learning what was going on) was the "sesquicentennial" one, in which the two word warning caused the clue to only be able to fit "sum 1 over", which was far more cryptic than "sum over by 1".

daveguth
Daveguth  (Level: 254.0 - Posts: 1636)
Sat, 20th Mar '10 5:50 PM

I hate to be a nitpicker, but on that one about the world's longest name, doesn't 600-555=45, not 35? So it should have read that the answer was 11 over (or under or whatever)?

Sploofus Editor
Sploofishy (Editor)  
Sat, 20th Mar '10 7:00 PM

Yes, yes it does.

Sploofus Editor
Sploofunky (Editor)  
Sat, 20th Mar '10 7:40 PM

Just to clarify, it looks like the world's longest surname contains 590 letters. See, for example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfe%2B585,_Senior

So, the math for that phrase would be: 590 - 555 = 34. The given difference is under by one since the correct answer should be 35.

We hope that helps!

kaufman
Kaufman  (Level: 256.8 - Posts: 3936)
Sat, 20th Mar '10 8:16 PM

That guy's last name is German.

Surely there's a Welshman with one twice as long ...

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.8 - Posts: 9952)
Sat, 20th Mar '10 8:32 PM

Well, these confused me but did not cost me any moves

bowled perfectly plus sesquicentennial equals Fahrenheit four fifty one ("Sum 1over (wrds 4&5 = 1 wrd)")
300 + 150 = 451 The given sum is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 450

I would say the given sum is under by one.


magnesiums atomic number minus mount rushmore heads equals the film seven ("Difference under by 1")
12 - 4 = 7 The given difference is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 8

I would say the given difference is over by one.


harry potter books minus books in the pentateuch equals a trilogy ("Difference over by 1")
7 - 5 = 3 The given difference is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 2

I would say the given difference is under by one.



Sploofus Editor
Sploofishy (Editor)  
Sat, 20th Mar '10 10:11 PM

Thanks, Sploofunky! I mean I still screwed up, just in my faulty memory for what the numbers I was originally working with. I thought it would have been fitting anyway, since I did say that I was having Math Problems.


Collioure, I'm not following you. How is 451 (the given sum) 1 under 450 (the correct answer)?

I am operating off the following definitions of these mathematical functions, perhaps you are using the terminology differently

addition: addend + addend = sum
subtraction: minuend − subtrahend = difference
multiplication: factor x factor = product
division: dividend / divisor = quotient



kaufman
Kaufman  (Level: 256.8 - Posts: 3936)
Sat, 20th Mar '10 11:03 PM

I understand what Andy's saying, and I think he's using the same terminology. The issue is that while the puzzle is of the form [explicit addend1] + [explicit addend 2] = [explicit sum], the two addends in reality sum to an implied actual sum that is one off the explicit sum.

It's a matter of semantics when seeing "sum one too high" whether one will interpret that as "explicit sum one too high" or "implied actual sum one too high". I'd say both are justifiable.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.8 - Posts: 9952)
Sun, 21st Mar '10 4:59 AM

Let me try this one more time. I should not have used the word "given" as it did not appear in the clues.


bowled perfectly plus sesquicentennial equals Fahrenheit four fifty one ("Sum 1over (wrds 4&5 = 1 wrd)")
300 + 150 = 451 The given sum is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 450

I would say the sum (not the given sum) is under by one. The sum is 450, the given sum is 451.


magnesiums atomic number minus mount rushmore heads equals the film seven ("Difference under by 1")
12 - 4 = 7 The given difference is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 8

I would say the difference (not the given difference) is over by one. The difference is 7; the given difference is 8.


harry potter books minus books in the pentateuch equals a trilogy ("Difference over by 1")
7 - 5 = 3 The given difference is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 2

I would say difference (not the given difference) is under by one. The difference is 2; the given difference is 3.

The word "given" was not in the clues and that changes the meaning.


pepperdoc
Pepperdoc  (Level: 152.5 - Posts: 4286)
Sun, 21st Mar '10 5:24 AM

Once I got in the flow of where the author was going, the pattern made sense to me.

collioure
Collioure  (Level: 104.8 - Posts: 9952)
Sun, 21st Mar '10 7:58 AM

CORRECTION

Let me try this one more time. I should not have used the word "given" as it did not appear in the clues.


bowled perfectly plus sesquicentennial equals Fahrenheit four fifty one ("Sum 1over (wrds 4&5 = 1 wrd)")
300 + 150 = 451 The given sum is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 450

I would say the sum (not the given sum) is under by one. The sum is 450, the given sum is 451.


magnesiums atomic number minus mount rushmore heads equals the film seven ("Difference under by 1")
12 - 4 = 7 The given difference is under by 1 since the correct answer should be 8

I would say the difference (not the given difference) is over by one. The difference is 8; the given difference is 7.


harry potter books minus books in the pentateuch equals a trilogy ("Difference over by 1")
7 - 5 = 3 The given difference is over by 1 since the correct answer should be 2

I would say difference (not the given difference) is under by one. The difference is 2; the given difference is 3.

The word "given" was not in the clues and that changes the meaning.


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